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Dayna Colbert and Dana Black. Credit: Indiana Democratic Party and Dana Black
On the eve of a Presidential election being decided by a handful of swing states, we sat down with two women in Indiana to talk about what it takes to make progress in a place that is largely neglected by the national Democratic Party Machine. Dayna Colbert, Executive Director of the Hoosier Democratic Party, talks about their growing foothold, led by women. And, political podcaster Dana Black talks about how to maintain an authentic voice while working alongside the official Democratic Party.
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TRANSCRIPT
Progressive Women are Shaping Indiana’s Political Future (transcript)
Show Button: [00:00:00] Making, making, making contact. Making contact.
Amy Gastelum: I’m Amy Gastelum. This is Making Contact.
Lindsey Reiser: We begin our report on the campaign trail. Both candidates are descending on Pennsylvania. The Keystone State is one of the most crucial battleground states for both Vice President Kamala Harris and former President Donald Trump in this election.
Amy Gastelum: On the eve of this Presidential election most of the coverage is happening in swing states. But even states that have been marked as taken by the national Democratic or Republican parties have surprising and sometimes electrifying down ballot races making headlines. Today, we’re talking about how progressive women in Indiana have stepped up despite being overlooked by the national Democratic machine. Come on in, this is the red state down ballot chat you [00:01:00] didn’t know you needed.
Stay with us
(music)
Today’s show is a two part interview. In the first half we’re talking with Dayna Colbert, the Executive Director of the Indiana Democratic Party. Ms. Colbert is also the fifth district chair for the Indiana Young Democrats and recently stepped down from her position as county chair for the Hamilton County Democrats. I started our interview asking [00:02:00] her how she got involved with politics. She said she always voted and was pretty politically aware, but as far as jumping in herself? She had not considered it until…
Dayna Colbert: Honestly, it was when Trump got elected, seeing him and seeing his rhetoric and thinking back and realizing that my mother was a teenager during the civil rights movement. And being a young Black woman, watching this rhetoric, making those connections, I thought I needed to do something. And I looked around, tried to figure out where it would make the most sense to do something. And it was looking at the local level.
Amy Gastelum: Dayna plugged in as a precinct chair in Hamilton County, which is just north of Indianapolis. From there, her rise in the local party was meteoric. She ran for and won county chair in 2021 and recently ended her term.
Amy Gastelum: You were one of the youngest county chairs in the state, and one of only a handful [00:03:00] of Black women county chairs in the state. And you were doing this in a county that is predominantly white and conservative, which is Hamilton County. Okay, so for our listeners who aren’t familiar with Indiana, I want to give some context. Hamilton County sits just north of Indianapolis. And in my mind, is made up of wealthy suburbs. Places like Carmel and Fishers. And, besides the wealthy, um, suburbs, Hamilton County also includes rural communities like Arcadia. Um, but the whole county, like I said, is pretty conservative um, so. With all of that context in, in, in mind, you’re the person that I want to ask, like, what is the point, right? Like, why should people who hold progressive values even try to have a political voice in a place like Hamilton County?
Dayna Colbert: Well, we’ve heard it a lot in Hamilton County. Um, it has been [00:04:00] traditionally quote unquote ruby red, but that was before and when Trump got elected. Since 2018 and on, we broke 40 percent of the vote across all of our state, we hadn’t done that before. In 2019 we got three Democrats elected, two in Fishers and one in Carmel at the city council level. You can also look at the Westfield City Council elections last year. Alexis Lowry ran for a district. She lost by 24 votes. 24 votes, she would have won.
Amy Gastelum: Hey it’s Amy. When I fact checked this interview, I found that Lowry actually lost by 23 votes.
Dayna Colbert: Those small gains is a neighborhood. If you go out and you talk to your neighbors and get them to vote, we can start to bring more balance back to the local level and build that up to the state level and then eventually can build it up again to the national level in our national politics here in Indiana. Um, so it’s incremental change, right? That’s the big thing. You have to fight for that incremental change and take those wins where you can. That 40 percent breaking that 40 percent is huge.
Amy Gastelum: So speaking of Hoosier [00:05:00] Democrats, Destiny Wells is another Democrat woman getting a lot of attention these days, right? She’s running for Attorney General against Todd Rokita, the Republican incumbent who’s been in the national news for making some inflammatory remarks about a physician who provided abortion care to a 10-year-old girl. He was reprimanded by the Indiana High Court for his remarks. And some say that he not only abused his power in the statement that he made, but that he’s really compromised the integrity of the position of Attorney General. So Is it possible for Wells to win even if Indiana remains red in the presidential election? Like does she have a chance at all?
Dayna Colbert: I think Destiny Wells is positioned in a really good place. Voters might not know. Okay. Who’s your attorney general? But they know the name Todd Rokita, so I think once you start to make that connection, voters like, Oh no, we don’t want that representing us. We don’t want to continue to be in the news as Hoosiers [00:06:00] for terrible things that are coming out of our attorney general’s mouth. So I think that Destiny Wells does have a really good opportunity to capitalize on that and make sure that we have somebody who is in the office who is going to fight for Hoosiers and not continue to just fight for culture wars. So I think that even if Indiana doesn’t go blue for the president. A lot of our down ballots, Destiny Wells, as well as Jennifer McCormick and Valerie McCray, do have a good chance of winning.
Amy Gastelum: Okay. Um, what is the easiest way for regular shmegular people to plug into local politics? Like step one, do this basic thing.
Dayna Colbert: Oh, step zero is making sure that you’re registered to vote. Um, and you can check that on indianavoters.com. Step one is actually doing your research and seeing, you can look on indianavoters.com on who’s on your ballot, and finding, hey, you know what, these candidates are running in my area, let me reach out to them and volunteer.
Dayna Colbert: So reaching out to those campaigns that are nearest to you, and saying, hey, I want to [00:07:00] help. They need people to go out and talk to people on the doors. They need people to go and make phone calls. They need people to help them stuff envelopes. They need people to help with social media. They need your help and a skill that you can provide. They can figure out a way to get you connected.
Amy Gastelum: What else should we know? What’s the thing that you’re burning to say that I haven’t asked you?
Dayna Colbert: There are people in our state, specifically women, who are concerned about whether or not their vote is private. And it is. Your vote is private. So once you go into the voting booth, nobody knows how you’re going to vote.
Dayna Colbert: So if there are women who are listening who are concerned about their husbands, their fathers, et cetera, knowing how you’re going to vote, don’t be. Your vote is private. So you can vote however you want once you get into that voting booth.
Amy Gastelum: The fact that you’re even saying that, [00:08:00] is, um, like, it’s really concerning. Um, why is that the message that needs to be put out? Like, where, where is that coming from?
Dayna Colbert: Well, I’ve seen it canvassing. Um, in previous years we canvassed and we’ve had the woman that we want to talk to but the man answers the door and he’s like, ‘my wife’s not going to vote for you, blah, blah, blah.’ But why is she on our list, then? Because she is going to vote for us. So the husband doesn’t know. And sometimes we’ll, we’d have follow ups after canvassing, like the, the wife would come out, say, hey, like, I’m gonna vote for you, but it’s a quiet, it’s a quiet affirmation. There are a lot of quiet affirmations from women who are saying that they’re going to vote our way. I have heard it from my own experiences canvassing, um, and some of our other folks who are going out and canvassing too. Um, I think it’s [00:09:00] stemming from, you know, wanting to keep the peace in your own home. I think that’s a big part of it. But I think probably part of it is some of the misinformation that’s going on. Um, people are very concerned about that. The integrity of our elections. And so if you’re hearing this constantly that, you know, ‘our elections aren’t safe and aren’t secure,’ then you’re going to start to wonder, well, is my vote going to stay private? So I think that misinformation that’s going on is also a key part of why there are women who are concerned about whether or not their vote is private.
Amy Gastelum: Okay. Thank you so much for, for joining us today and spending some you know, some of your precious time at this point in the season, uh, talking to us and, um, yeah, we look forward to seeing what happens in Hamilton County, what happens across the state of Indiana, um, in the next few months. [00:10:00] Thanks.
Morris Master: This is Mo Master from WNUC 96. 7 FM in Detroit. Just jumping in to remind you that you’re listening to Making Contact. We play Making Contact at 3:00 p.m. on Thursdays because we appreciate the breaking news and documentary style public affairs that they offer to our listeners. If you want to hear Making Contact where you live, contact your local community or public radio station and ask them to play Making Contact. Okay, now back to the show.
Amy Gastelum: I’m Amy Gastelum. In the second half of the show today we’re sitting down with Dana Black. Yes, we’re talking to two Dana’s today. It is the Dana show. Dana Black is a political podcaster and a former candidate for Indiana House.
Dana Black: I’m the loudest mouth in Indiana Democratic politics. And, uh, thank you for taking the time to chat with me.
Amy Gastelum: Ms. Black ran for the Indiana House [00:11:00] in 2016. She didn’t win, but that experience set her on a path to advocacy and public speaking, AND she produces the political podcast, Turn Left and a special collaborative series called Let’s Talk Indiana – where hosts break down Project 2025 for listeners.
Amy Gastelum: I’ve listened to a few of your shows and the Let’s Talk Indiana are, like, I was kind of surprised and delighted that the conversation was like so Frank, you know what I mean? Cause I feel like, do you feel like, like Hoosiers tend to be kind of like ‘let’s be nice above everything else’ above everything else. And you’re like, but We can’t afford to, you know what I mean?
Dana Black: Well, that’s the goal. I mean right now the stakes are so high and you’re right, Indiana likes their politics sweet. I mean, if you take a look at Mike Pence and Pete Buttigieg, they’re very, ideologically they’re opposites, but if you listen to their deliveries They’re relatively the [00:12:00] same. And that’s how Indiana likes its politics. Which is why I know I will never be an elected official in Indiana because they’re not ready for all of this smoke.
Amy Gastelum: Let’s talk about it. Like, um, back in 2016 you ran for Indiana House of Representatives against Brian Bosma. Right? So what inspired that move? Talk about that.
Dana Black: Yeah, I was angry. Um, you know, I used to be a TV yeller. I would watch MSNBC and just point and yell at the TV. I’ve always been, always been passionate about politics, but it was RFRA.
Amy Gastelum: Okay, I’m jumping in to explain. RFRA is the Religious Freedom Restoration Act. It was signed into law in the spring of 2015. And, in a nutshell, opponents worried that it would allow businesses to discriminate against LGBTQ+ people. Which it did. Brian Bosma was house speaker at the time, and played an integral part in getting the bill passed.
Dana Black: And as a person in the LGBTQ plus community, I’m like, I thought we already went [00:13:00] through this public accommodation thing in the civil rights movement. And when I went to go cast a vote against him in 2014, there was nobody on the ballot.
Dana Black: And that angered me because it was like, wait a second. I don’t even have a choice here. So in 2016, I got all my ducks in a row and I said, you know what, I’m a challenge him. Now, obviously, I didn’t get enough votes to take that seat, but that election was a winning election, or campaign, and let me tell you why. One, there were three other women, one, another woman of color, that came behind me to challenge that seat when no one had ever done it before, uh, well, it had been a while. I had received more votes than anyone running against him at that time, but then the subsequent women received even more votes than I did.
Dana Black: Um, and then from there, I became the deputy chair of the, of the party, I started my podcast, um, and started giving speeches all over the state. So it was a win because people saw the energy that I put into the campaign and they were like, Oh, there’s a way, there’s ways for you to do that. So you don’t have to be an elected [00:14:00] official to have an impact. And that was the lesson I learned. You don’t have to be elected official to have impact. Now I, instead of focusing in on myself being a candidate, I can help 30, 40 other candidates by amplifying their message.
Amy Gastelum: So during that that 2016 time when you were running and everything like what kind of support did you receive?
Dana Black: It’s unique So I’m a very masculine of center lesbian, so I would wear ties cuff links I had long locks at the time and although people felt like my message was strong, they wanted me to change who I was and how I appeared to the world. You know, do you have a shirt? You know, do you have a picture with an open collar?
Amy Gastelum: Do you have a blouse?
Dana Black: Yes. Could, could you, you know, wear makeup, could you? No, because what I promised myself was. When I look in the mirror, I want to like me. I’m not going to change to make other people comfortable. That’s silly. Why would I be uncomfortable to make you comfortable? Um, I, what I found though, women responded very well [00:15:00] to the way I presented myself from a confidence perspective. I wasn’t always confident. But, um, and if I, if I, if I, if there was a base, if someone’s had to say, well Dana, what is your political base?
Dana Black: I would say it was white women. Sometimes the Black folks would give me a hard time. I’ve had Black supporters who were getting grief because they were supporting the lesbian, but then they, you know, wait a minute. You mean to tell me you think Brian Bosma is going to look out for Black people more than me?
Dana Black: I had to earn that respect, right? I just didn’t assume, because I was a Black woman and a lesbian, that all those different demographics were gonna just rock with me. I had to go earn that. And I did that by going into the communities and going to talk to people, knocking on doors. That was like, how the support came.
Dana Black: Um, I know, I’ll never forget standing in line, Uh, on election day and people saying how excited that they were, that they had a Democrat that they can vote for. And that was what it was all about. Giving people an opportunity to [00:16:00] have a choice, right?
Amy Gastelum: Um, is there anything you wanted to add about what that, how that changed you, how that running changed you?
Dana Black: It absolutely changed me. I was, when I ran, I was an angry lesbian. Because of, of RFRA, you know, but when you are running for the state house, you recognize that there are going to be bills and legislation that you’re going to be voting on that impacts the entire state. So you, I started to learn about the different issues that were happening around the state and the different things that were incredibly problematic to humans.
Dana Black: And so by the time I finished the campaign, I was an angry Hoosier and I was like, who is advocating for people? You know, yes, we have Democrats that are out here doing good work, but there’s, there’s these policies that are being written that are just harmful. And so how did it change me? I am an advocate for humans in Indiana. I don’t care what your political affiliation is. If you’re in [00:17:00] rural Indiana and you don’t have a medical facility, I am going to advocate and fight for a candidate that is going to make sure that you have the medical necessities that you need in your rural town, even if you never vote for a Democrat.
My real passion now is, uh, about how do I support those candidates and how do I elect as many Democrats as I possibly can because I know I’m never going to agree 100 percent with any candidate, but more than likely, a Democrat is going to have policies and vote for legislation that may be 75 to 80 percent aligned with my values.
Dana Black: And that’s the most important thing for me. That’s how I’ve changed – my passion for making sure that there are people in elected positions who are writing good policy.
Amy Gastelum: And that gets to one of my questions, which is like is there some freedom in running on progressive values in a place that is so conservative that it’s sort of neglected by the big democratic party machine?
Dana Black: I [00:18:00] will say that it’s a struggle. I wish they paid more attention. I wish we weren’t a flyover state because, um, resources.
Dana Black: So I struggle with that aspect. When I was the deputy chair of engagement of the state party, I felt more constricted than I do now, not having a title in the party. And that is because, um, uh, people wanted to restrict my personal opinions, but my philosophy always was if I have a seat at the table and I’m not advocating for my demographics, then why am I there?
Dana Black: Look at Georgia. A lot of the change that happened in Georgia for Georgia to flip blue had less to do with the party than it did for, with nonprofit organizations that were working outside of the party apparatus.
Dana Black: They were getting people registered to vote. They were getting, you know, getting information out to rule Georgia. And that to me was a lesson. Oh, I don’t have to have a title. I can just continue to do the [00:19:00] work and I can still, you know, promote the party and I can still promote what the party is doing and, and be on board and, and be down with it,
Dana Black: and I can say what I need to say without somebody trying to check me, you know, do you know how hard it is being checked? I’m 54 years old. You don’t get to dictate to me what I can and can’t say, can and can’t do.
Dana Black: And I’m a grown-ass woman. How are you going to tell me? And that was one of the problems that I had was like, you trying to tell me as a grown-ass woman, what I can and I can’t do within the party structure. All right, cool. Well, I’ll tell you what, I’ll step outside the party structure and I’m still going to do the things that I want to do. I’m still going to amplify the issues. I’m still going to amplify candidates and I can do it on my own terms. Okay.
Amy Gastelum: I found your podcast from the democratic party website. So like it’s still, there’s still love there, but it’s like, you’re a little bit outside.
Dana Black: Absolutely there’s love, you know, I will always, always promote people getting involved with the party because there’s structure there, right? It’s…nothing is perfect. And when I joined [00:20:00] the party, I felt like they could use more volunteers versus complaints. So I got involved because I saw some holes that I could fill. And I will always, always say, hey, if there’s something you don’t like about the party, get involved.
Dana Black: And a buddy of mine, Uh, Regina Moore down in Bloomington.
Amy Gastelum: I know Regina Moore.
Dana Black: Yeah, she broke down the party and what it means to be a Democrat. You have your elected officials, right, who are, uh, who are Democrats. You also have the party leadership. They are Democrats. But the voters, the rank and file, we are also Democrats.
Dana Black: And so when someone says, well, what is the Democratic Party doing to address this issue? You should look in the mirror and say, well, what am I doing? Because I am a part of the party. I am a part of the change, right? And so, we’re all in this thing. And if we want things to be better, we have to get down.
Dana Black: So yes, if you want to get involved, get involved. They need the help. Bring whatever skills you have to the table. [00:21:00] Don’t try to be Dana. Don’t try to be Amy. Be who you are with the skill set that you have. And I promise you, you will be able to help us in this movement.
Amy Gastelum: Well, speaking of Dana, I did talk to Dayna Colbert and she,
Dana Black: Oh, the cool Dayna.
Amy Gastelum: She, she told me to tell you, oh my gosh, you’re talking to the cooler Dana, the cool Dana. So, all right. Okay. It goes both ways.
Dana Black: Absolutely. I’m so proud of her. Um, I remember meeting her years ago, watching her take over the Hamilton County Democratic Party, her filling her slate and causing such a ruckus up there that the Republicans were spending crazy money, which they never had to do. Now she’s taking over the state party. I am so proud of her. And, and guys, this woman is a brilliant woman. She’s sweet and she’s, you know, quiet. She’s the quieter Dayna. That’s for damn sure. But she is brilliant. Do not underestimate her. She’s an amazing woman.
Amy Gastelum: She’s definitely got a backbone. Speaking of speaking of Hamilton County and what went down with Dayna , [00:22:00] in leadership there, like how conservative do you think Indiana is for real? Like how permanent is our current experience? How much of the idea that Indiana is. So ruby red is actually real and true to you. You’re shaking your head.
Dana Black: I don’t believe so. I don’t believe it’s as red as people think it is. What I think is that we have a turnout problem. Uh, Indiana ranks 50th in the nation in voter turnout and if Marion County is only turning out 12 percent and and it’s a state of only 7 million, less than 7 million, and a million of them are in Marion County and we’re not turning out, that’s the problem.
Dana Black: I believe that if we can get people. To the polls, get ’em registered and get ’em to the polls and giving them a reason, get ’em excited, excited about who they’re voting for. I think things change. For example, 2008 they called, they wanted to call, uh, for McCain , but they forgot we have two different time zones and Evansville and Lake County hadn’t closed.
Dana Black: And once Lake County came in, [00:23:00] again, another blue dot. In this state. People need to understand -yeah, there are a lot of counties that are red, but those counties have very low population, right? If we turn out Marion County, Allen County, Lake County, Vanderburg County, St. Joe County, and then the college towns, we win this state.
Dana Black: I’m not saying that we neglect any of those other counties, but they just don’t have the sheer number of humans. And if you notice, Hamilton County, the more it grows in population, the more purple it is becoming. So where there are people, they are blue. We just have to get them motivated and get them to the polls.
Amy Gastelum: Given the recent excitement over Kamala Harris’s, um, you know, leadership right now, like, what’s going to be the effect of that on some of these down ballot, uh, things like even like the governor, even like the Attorney General, like, what do you think? You’re nodding.
Dana Black: Yeah, I think it [00:24:00] will have a positive effect down ballot. First of all, think about this. Um, in Indiana, we have all women at the top of our tickets. So not only do we have Vice President Harris. We have Jennifer McCormick is running for governor. We have Valerie McCray, who’s running for United States Senate. We have Destiny Wells, who’s a dear friend of mine, running for Attorney General. We have the opportunity in Indiana to not only make history with our President, but we have, we’ve never had a woman Governor. We’ve never, you know, we’ve never had a woman Attorney General. We’ve never sent a woman to the United States Senate. So we have the opportunity. I even believe it’s going to happen in our state house. I believe there’s house seats and Senate, state Senate seats that are going to benefit from what is happening at the top of the ticket, because honestly, abortion is on the ballot. Women’s body autonomy is on the ballot. And I personally, I think Micah Beckwith is dangerous. I think he’s incredibly dangerous. He is a person who believes in white Christian nationalism. He believes that we are a Christian nation. He wants to indoctrinate people into believing [00:25:00] that we are a Christian nation when the constitution over and over says, no, we’re not. We’re a secular nation and whatever religion you choose to practice, we’re going to make sure that you are protected and able to do so.
Dana Black: I am more worried about Micah Beckwith as Lieutenant Governor than I am anything else because his history of chaos is documented and he is going to bring chaos to the State House. I think we need to get rid of Todd Rokita. He’s the kind of person that goes after an OBGYN who is trying to save the life of a 10 year old rape victim. He spends more time at the Mexican border instead of at the Kentucky border. We need people who are going to look out for Hoosiers, and these clowns are not doing that. They’re trying to score political points and kiss the orange menace ring. When we have, we are at the bottom statistically of pretty much every category that is related to the quality of life here in Indiana. And why, why are we allowing that to happen? And why do we allow people to [00:26:00] put us in positions where we’re losing the best and the brightest?
Dana Black: IU just had an article out that said that they are sending their OBGYN candidates to other places. So that means women in Indiana are going to suffer.
Amy Gastelum: Especially rural women, especially Black women.
Dana Black: Yeah. I, as you can see, I’m a little passionate about, you know, the policies that are being written. And who is, is in charge of those policies. So, yeah, I get wound up a little bit.
Amy Gastelum: I get it. I mean, because we’re living it, you know? Um, alright. so because my next question is like for regular schmegular people like what is step one if they want to start getting more involved in local politics?
Dana Black: Step one identify what you are passionate about because if you know what you are passionate about, I promise you there’s a policy or an ordinance that’s connected to it. Okay. Once you realize what’s most important to you, you can either [00:27:00] work with a nonprofit grassroots advocacy group, volunteering your time, you can volunteer your time with your local party. They always need help. Trust, know, and believe they always need help. That is the first place to look. If you’re not sure who your local party person is. Go online and Google it. Google is your friend, people.
Dana Black: I know that Google is in, is in the, in the news right now for being a monopoly for their search engine, but Google it. If you really, really want to get involved, take the steps to educate yourself. Stop waiting for people to tell you what to do, right? Do you need somebody to tell you how to get up and brush your teeth in the morning? Do you need somebody to tell you how to drive your car to get to work? Find your passion. Your passion will fuel you. And for me, you know, being a verbal communicator, getting the message out, talking about the issues, hyping people up.
Dana Black: You know, I tell people, there ain’t no better hype person in the state of Indiana. You can find better [00:28:00] fundraisers. You can find better organizers. You can find better leaders. But you will never find anybody in Indiana that will hype the crowd than Indiana’s own Dana Black and I, I stand, I stand on that.
Amy Gastelum: That’s fair. I’ve seen you, so that, I think that’s fair. Um, alright, last question is basically this. What is that burning thing that you’re like, people should know this and I didn’t know to ask it?
Dana Black: Be resilient. Have a thick skin. And recognize everything takes time. You know, I remind people, you know, between Seneca Falls and the 19th Amendment was almost, was over 75 years. And it didn’t apply to all women. So it takes time. You know, from the end of Reconstruction to the 1964 Civil Rights Act and 65 Voting Rights Act, it took time. You know, nothing is instant. You know, society is not a remote control where you can push a button. It turns on and turns off, be resilient, but find your purpose and bring it to the movement. That’s, [00:29:00] that’s what I got. Yeah.
Amy Gastelum: I’m Amy Gastelum. That does it for Making Contact today. We are a nationally broadcast show so I want to remind folks everywhere that early voting is already available in several states. If you’re not sure about how to do it in your state…
Dana Black: Go online and Google it. Google is your friend, people.
Amy Gastelum: Until next week.